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Truth and Provability

Discussion in 'Mature Discussion' started by Mike, Dec 28, 2008.

  1. Dec 28, 2008 #1
    Mike

    Mike Member

    What does it mean for something to be true?

    Are there only two options, or is the "True-False" paradigm a false dichotomy?

    Is there an ultimate truth? Are humans capable of knowing this ultimate truth?

    What constitutes a proof? That is, a demonstration beyond all possible doubt. How do we prove things?

    What does it mean to prove things?

    Can we ever prove this ultimate truth?


    Discuss.
     
  2. Dec 28, 2008 #2
    Chocobo Dyl

    Chocobo Dyl New Member

    Can we ever prove that we can prove the ultimate truth?

    Can we prove that the ultimate truth is existent?
    Wow,this is confusing. I'll go for a question that I might be able to understand.The fourth one,a demostratio beyod all possible doubt?Does this exist? Hmmm,really we debate to put forth our ideas ad to make other people realise them,and to believe them.Thinking about religion and other stuff,I don't think this is possible.
     
  3. Dec 28, 2008 #3
    Mike

    Mike Member

    Good point Chocobo.

    The experimental method (that which is used to classify something as 'scientific' and not just coincidence or an isolated incident) is inherently flawed for this reason.

    We can never say that 100% of the time, let's say, dropping a ball will cause it to fall to the earth (due to gravity). We have reason to believe it will...I doubt it will ever fly off to outer space or anything like that...but we can't prove it will fall every single time.

    We can only say "Over the last 10,000,000,000,000 trials, it has always fallen to earth." And thus draw a conclusion like "We are 99.9999999% confident that the ball will fall, if dropped the next time."

    But this is not a proof...


    Note that just because something is unprovable, does not mean it's not true! In math, it's been proven that certain things cannot be proven nor disproven...For instance, there is something called the Axiom of Choice.

    New question: Is a 'mathematical proof' different from a 'scientific proof' ?

    And so the punchline is...

    Is there some perfect extension of the scientific method? One in which we can make direct causal statements, and derive a notion of proof?
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2008

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