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Does SE keep Nomura from focusing on KH?

Discussion in 'General Kingdom Hearts' started by Derek, Jun 13, 2019.

  1. Derek

    Derek Well-Known Member

    Saw this on YT today.

    I dont normally watch KH vids pertaining to this kinda topic but seemed like an interesting question to get opinions on.
  2. Desert Warrior

    Desert Warrior Well-Known Member

    It's hard to tell. Personally I would assume there's a bit of misunderstanding with what Kitase said, but I might be wrong. Personally I feel it has more to do with Square themselves. From what it seems, it's like they treat Nomura as their top director or a ridiculously important one. Combine that with the Japanese work ethich and you've got a man being pulled apart by 2 ridiculously massive projects and all the expectations that go with them.

    Funny thing is I remember back before KH3 came out that Nomura or somebody else from Square said that FFVIIR was essentially going to be put on hold until KH3 came out. Thinking about it now though, with what they've shown at E3 plus the fact that the first part of this remake is set to go on sale in March of next year, I'm not sure how true that was.
  3. Derek

    Derek Well-Known Member

    I'm unsure how true it is as well. One thing I always did remember even now is Nomura himself once saying some games only existed due to like Nintendo, Disney, etc.
    So I've always taken this to mean that some level of corporate meddling interferes with him. I dont agree with some choices he's made even now but I dont doubt some of it is SE's fault.

    In the case of this, I can honestly see it being half true at the least.
  4. Desert Warrior

    Desert Warrior Well-Known Member

    Thinking on it now, something I kinda brushed off as possibly misinterpreting Kitase's statement is what Kitase said about Nomura's enthusiasm with working on FFVIIR. Personally if I were Nomura, I would prefer to be working on KH related things and see other projects as interfering with that. After all KH is essentially his baby. He was just a costume designer on FFVII way back when, so the core aspects of the remake aren't his ideas. Unless of course there's gonna be a ton of stuff he added in the remake that wasn't in the original (After all this first bit that gets released next March only covers the Midgar segment of the game. 1/3 of disk 1 if we're being generous with estimating how much of the original took place in Midgar).
  5. Derek

    Derek Well-Known Member

    Eh I wouldn't rule out he's excited on some level. The remake is the first time so many of those older people have worked together again in a long time. And, to be honest, Nomura having limited control of what he can alter is more of a positive imo.
    Both for characters and for himself since he can focus more on gameplay aspects of what they'll fill out the segments with. It's like editing a beloved story, you can leave it be and just add little things to flesh it out.

    They even have the old FF7 compilation to pull ideas from. I know that stuff is meh for most but Crisis Core alone gives plenty to use for a flash back with Zack, as an example.
  6. Desert Warrior

    Desert Warrior Well-Known Member

    I do think part of the purpose of this remake is to make it fit better with the rest of the FFVII continuity.

    I would be careful about saying Nomura has limited control on what's changing in the game. Obviously we're not gonna be able to see how much until the game itself comes out, but this first part is supposed to be a full sized game that only covers the beginning of the game. Like I said early, maybe 1/3 of disk 1.

    The trailers themselves haven't really shown any changes to the story... Except the part where Aerith gets scared from something, grabs Cloud's hands, and suddenly Cloud can see some ghost things. I don't remember that happening in the original FFVII.
  7. Derek

    Derek Well-Known Member

    I doubt they'll make it a part of the old continuity. Some of it can't even be used now cause the actor who's likeness was used for Genesis said they can't use it no more. And without Genesis the Crisis Core story is butchered due to how much it revolved around that.

    I mean in terms of story and characterization. He can't alter that much cause they're remaking the old story. Heck I'd hate to see how more true FF fans than me would even react if he tried to. (even I dont like the emo Kh ver of cloud)

    Which is an example of what I mean. It'll be altered to fit it's remade structure but your story beats wont at the core. I could see expansions on some things though like a more detailed event of Sephiroth murdering the town or Zack's character flashbacks.
  8. Desert Warrior

    Desert Warrior Well-Known Member

    That's interesting. Honestly I really didn't like Genesis. He was annoying and it felt like he suddenly hijacked the plot of Crisis Core. If he can't be used anymore, that messes with not only the Crisis Core story but additionally the stuff that comes after Dirge of Cerberus. Never played that one but supposedly it ends with Genesis awakening in order to stop some threat or something.

    Which came first, KH or Advent Children? Cuz one complaint I've heard from fans of Cloud (Which probably ties back to Nomura. Fun stuff) is that his emo characterization is prevalent in basically all games he's in except FFVII itself. But the blame for the emo version ties back to KH or Advent Children (Probably KH, not gonna lie) and ever since then Cloud's character has been derailed into something he really wasn't by the end of FFVII.
  9. Kitty

    Kitty I Survived The BG Massacre Staff Member Administrator

    KH came out in North America in 2002, Advent Children was released in 2006.

    I'm not sure if I would call Cloud emo in FF VII, although I'm sure I've used that term in the past. I do think he's mentally ill and he handles it probably about as well as could be expected given the situations he finds himself in. And I wouldn't say that Advent Children necessarily does his character a disservice. I think he kind of had it together at the end of VII, because he had to, there was work to be done, but once Sephiroth was defeated and the day was saved, I could see him sliding backwards to the person we find in Advent Children. He gets better. KH Cloud on the other hand lacks humor and seems more like Vincent in Cloud's body. I think they were going for that with the incorporation of parts of Vincent's costume into the KH I Cloud's get up. I played KH before I played VII and thought KH Cloud was cool enough, but I hope the remake keeps his character truer to the original.

    I don't think it happened either. I'd say it definitely didn't happen, but it's possible I'm forgetting some tiny scene buried somewhere in disc one.

    In regards to the video linked in the first post, I'd say that while the quote could be misinterpreted, I think it wouldn't be surprising to hear that a man splitting his time between two massive projects wasn't able to devote as much time as he may have liked to either of them. Hopefully the VII remake fairs better than KH III seems to be.
  10. Derek

    Derek Well-Known Member

    I didn't like him that much either, what I enjoyed most about Crisis Core was Zack himself. Zack, as he was characterized, can be used thankfully but I wouldn't expect plot points of CC. Genesis really did hijack the plot which renders most of it useless now.

    They essentially did merge Vincent and Cloud for the KH version of him I think. Which, at the time, I didn't know the difference but after getting a glimpse of what Cloud is like in CC I could see why KH Cloud is annoying.

    I know the plot of 7 has him struggling mentally but he still has humor and how he is once his mind is in a proper state is a far more likable character.
    Granted, KH takes FF cast and alters them to fit into that new universe which I rather like. I know they can't be developed as if they were leads in KH but I'd at least hope the most likable aspects of their original self makes it into KH.

    Such as the slight different take on Leon/Squall, Aerith, Cid and Yuffie being mostly the same, or even extremes like Yuna and her group being fairies. (more based on their x-2 writing than yunas x writing)

    I think the remake will have to keep him truer to himself. Nomura can't change the plot much without a mob attacking SE HQ. FF7 is one of those vastly loved titles, it hooked many into FF, changing it too much is a risk even he wouldn't take I'd imagine.
    They'll add new bits so the larger story flows better, they'd have too, but I bet the core & characters story is the same.
  11. Kitty

    Kitty I Survived The BG Massacre Staff Member Administrator

    VII Cloud was kind of a dope. For one, I can't see KH Cloud running around Midgar looking for frilly panties and asking prostitutes to do his makeup so he can disguise himself as a chick and get information out of a sleazebag (the remake better leave this ridiculousness in or I riot). But even aside from that, there's a lot of humor in his dialogue and the choices you can make, and the rest of VII's cast plays off him well, in my opinion, especially dudes like Barret. KH Cloud's whole identity revolves around Sephiroth in a weird way. And he's just so depressed sounding, I wanna shake him. The more I think about my comment of Vincent in Cloud's body, the more it makes sense to me. And it's weird, because I can't think of anyone else in the FF cast who was done that way. If you want Vincent, just use Vincent. He's got plenty of beef with Sephiroth too, if you want to keep that angle.

    I would imagine that S-E would keep potential fan backlash in mind, but that hasn't stopped plenty of other creators from doing what they want *coughgameofthronescough* *coughhanshotfirstcough*, so I wouldn't be so quick to say there won't be major changes. I mean, I don't think they would fundamentally change the characters or the major plot points in the story, but especially if the game is being expanded, I'd say there's a lot of room for differences. Hopefully it's not being half-assed, since some fans are likely to get ugly with how long some people have been waiting for this.
  12. Derek

    Derek Well-Known Member

    Now that you mention it I think Cloud is, by far, the most drastic alteration which makes it all the more odd. I hear Sepher and his group are off but I also encounter the same people yelling that Yuffie isn't right either so I take their quips with grains of salt.

    Well that's different I think. Lucas owned it all at the time and had no "no men" to stop him or that he'd listen too. SE is a corporation and no matter what Nomura does he has to report his plans to someone. That doesn't mean he wont do something to upset people but the odds are less likely.

    I doubt anything fundamental will change either. The size will demand new stuff to fill out the parts. So the only concern for many is keeping characters true and parts they like such as the crossdressing moment.
    Kitty likes this.

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